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Post by arden on Jun 5, 2006 19:49:37 GMT -5
This discussion started in the Cafe, and Bill had mentioned that it might need it's own thread. I agree. Bill, I'd like to hear more of what you think...icubud and Kaj, too!! While I believe that the person who is levying the lip synching charges is one of the most vile posters I've ever run into, he seems to be making a pretty credible case to back himself up. He has now started a blog: www.escape-to-tape.blogspot.comI don't have the technology nor the expertise to confirm or debunk his claims, but maybe some here could listen for themselves. Several other music professionals have apparently listened to his evidence and agree that Augeri has been lip synching for the last couple of tours. What I find most interesting is what is NOT being said and WHO is staying very quiet abut the whole thing. The owner of the "other site" is known to be in Neal Schon's back pocket, and Perry fans know that Neal Schon has lurked that board and run back to BT to ridicule things that Perry fans said there. So it would be very easy for the site owner to get confirmation one way or the other with one phone call. He hasn't. He made no statement other than to tell people to move on or to close threads. Now the whole forum is locked for posting. However, you can still read the posts. The "official" Journey camp has made NO statements, but "employees" of Journey have come out of the woodwork over there to make very unprofessional threats and comments. Now they are resorting to bumping up year old threads to try and bury the threads with the lip synching discussions. No credible offering has been made to debunk the "evidence" other than "because I said so, and I'm in the know" type BS. The most laughable claim by some of the Journey cheerleaders is that this whole thing is a conspiracy cooked up by Perry fans. |
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Post by andy on Jun 5, 2006 20:38:17 GMT -5
Well now that is funny just why would Mr P 's fans cook something like that up? I don't know what to make of the whole thing myself.But have a feeling it is ture and that is sad.SA can't do it nite after nite i fell sure before all of this is over with he my not have a voice left.JMO! And we all know Neal dose not give a fig about anyone but his own self.I also feel this is it for the band you can't get any lower than they already are.
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Post by sindee67 on Jun 5, 2006 22:59:08 GMT -5
You know, MHO~! I wouldn't be surprised! YOu know, SA has a great singing voice, but, it's NOT STEVE PERRY! When you twist and turn your vocal cords in ways that he did, something is going to break, and it did....Didn't he have a situation earlier this year?
Steve A needs to tell these TURKEYS to fly away, and do his own thing, he could make it in the music industry, if he has a voice left!
Oh wait, what am I thinking, NEAL SCHON IS SUCH A BETTER GUITAR PLAYER THEN EDDIE VAN HALEN!!! Remember, Eddie's jealous of Neal, that's why they told JOURNEY "H*LL NO!" on the touring thing! 
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Post by Bill on Jun 6, 2006 0:46:40 GMT -5
I am stumped on this one, guess i need to hear more and I still don't know if its true or not or whatnot, but ill listen with an open mind and if it does pan out that all these shows and tracks are merging with exact vocal tracks (time will tell i guess) if it does happen that way I guess some answers will surface eventually...
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Post by kaj on Jun 6, 2006 1:18:23 GMT -5
This one is really hard to believe that it would be true coz Augeri is a good singer,I have always thought that he should sing more like the way he did on the Tall Stories album from 91 and not try to imitate Perry the whole time.
But I have seen a clip with him doing Liberty from the tour with Styx in 2004 and he just couldn´t reach the high notes,his voice almost like disappeared.
And I have heard that he has had problems with this voice on other boards so who knows,maybe he lip synched a few gigs coz he just couldn´t do a whole show?!
To talk about something else,I have made the decision tonight of buying all the re-masters that Perry will release from the Journey catalouge this year - gotta support the man!
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Post by Bill on Jun 6, 2006 1:22:40 GMT -5
Wouldn't fans notice if he was lipping? I mean if we watch tv one saturday afternoon and see a band on some tv show lippin usually I can tell they are doing it after a few mins, to stand on stage for 2-3 hrs night after night and not have a moment where fans say WHOA WAIT A MIN his mouth wasn't moving or something like that (has anyone read a comment like that anywhere?) It just seems to me at least that it would show somewhere somenight sometown someone would catch it and say something about it (I don't read around other forums much beyond here and the cooler now and then) so I don't really know what if anything like this has been mentioned or said.
But looking at it from that angle, it sure seems like it would be seen or called out beyond this whole listen to these 2 tracks they are identical, also if that is the case and tracks are being merged up and ARE in synch vocally, ok if that happens, how many songs a night do you guess are lipped vs actually sung, it makes no sense (to me unless I am missin somethin) to lip 5 out of 10 songs, if you were lippin id say lip 10 of 10, if thats the case ALL of these songs on these shows should would and will merge up 100% vocally, now if that happens and we hear say 12 songs all merged from two different shows yet all match 100% vocally then wow there is something that has to be explained.
I know there are folks who think this is true and others who think its fake and heck who really knows besides Augeri and the band, but if its fake someone somewhere will eventually mess up or step up or something will happen (with the future tracks posted if they match up 100%).
Bill
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Post by arden on Jun 6, 2006 1:33:30 GMT -5
That's just it, Bill. Fans have noticed. I have read posts by people mentioning that they had "caught" something. This has been brought up at least three times over the last 2-3 tours that I have read myself. Augeri would move the mic away from his mouth and the vocal would continue, questions about click tracks...the posts were always deleted. I believe that there are at least four different tracks up now. The explanation is that he is lipping to the 2001 DVD. I would imagine any song that is not on that DVD, is one that he has to sing live. We know that the 2001 DVD is the one exception to Augeri being allowed to record the classics, so that is the only one they have that has been recorded and polished with Augeri's voice. I think that if this is true, they are making a complete mockery of a once great band. Wouldn't fans notice if he was lipping? I mean if we watch tv one saturday afternoon and see a band on some tv show lippin usually I can tell they are doing it after a few mins, to stand on stage for 2-3 hrs night after night and not have a moment where fans say WHOA WAIT A MIN his mouth wasn't moving or something like that (has anyone read a comment like that anywhere?) It just seems to me at least that it would show somewhere somenight sometown someone would catch it and say something about it (I don't read around other forums much beyond here and the cooler now and then) so I don't really know what if anything like this has been mentioned or said. But looking at it from that angle, it sure seems like it would be seen or called out beyond this whole listen to these 2 tracks they are identical, also if that is the case and tracks are being merged up and ARE in synch vocally, ok if that happens, how many songs a night do you guess are lipped vs actually sung, it makes no sense (to me unless I am missin somethin) to lip 5 out of 10 songs, if you were lippin id say lip 10 of 10, if thats the case ALL of these songs on these shows should would and will merge up 100% vocally, now if that happens and we hear say 12 songs all merged from two different shows yet all match 100% vocally then wow there is something that has to be explained. I know there are folks who think this is true and others who think its fake and heck who really knows besides Augeri and the band, but if its fake someone somewhere will eventually mess up or step up or something will happen (with the future tracks posted if they match up 100%). Bill |
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Post by arden on Jun 6, 2006 1:37:42 GMT -5
Kaj, I think that his trying to sound too much like Perry instead of truly making the songs his own may have been his downfall. His voice just doesn't have the power and range of Perry's. He has clearly had some voice issues, but to resort to lip syncing instead of just bowing out gracefully is just deception. This one is really hard to believe that it would be true coz Augeri is a good singer,I have always thought that he should sing more like the way he did on the Tall Stories album from 91 and not try to imitate Perry the whole time. But I have seen a clip with him doing Liberty from the tour with Styx in 2004 and he just couldn´t reach the high notes,his voice almost like disappeared. And I have heard that he has had problems with this voice on other boards so who knows,maybe he lip synched a few gigs coz he just couldn´t do a whole show?! To talk about something else,I have made the decision tonight of buying all the re-masters that Perry will release from the Journey catalouge this year - gotta support the man! |
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Post by arden on Jun 6, 2006 1:48:16 GMT -5
This is a post from another board explaining how she witnessed another band doing the same thing and why it was so hard to detect. forums.melodicrock.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=16814&start=125"A few years ago,I witnessed the "method" we are discussing here: a concert situation with recorded voice tracks & live instruments.The band’s lead singer had a rebel flu and a nasty laryngitis, but they had a firm contract they had to honor,so they did it “Journey” style (sorry,couldn’t help it). They went in the studio and took the vocal tracks out from a live CD they had previously released;then they loaded the tracks in the keyboard player’s computer.18 songs,even the 3 tracks for the encore.I watched this closely.The keyboard player had the click track as well as all the others in their ear monitors.They would start off the songs,do some ad-libs,then the keyboardist would start the voice track.The lead singer would be either in the dark so no one sees the first word of the song(that’s the hard part to match,even if he has a click track),or he would hide his mouth behind the mike to "cloak" his vocal intro. After that,everything looked so natural…Funny enough,the backing vox were live,the bass player and the guitarist were singing for real.I saw all this first hand,backstage,plus someone from the tech crew gave me some more technical details.I also went to the mixer.The sound guy had monitors in which he heard the overall sound and made sure the taped voice blended with the live band perfectly.That was his only task.Oh,yeah and to keep the singer’s mike muted during the "singing". I believe that’s the procedure,no matter if it’s the No-One-Heard-Of-Them band or Journey. I have to say this...If I wouldn't have known (and seen) the inside story,I would have been fooled... especially if I would have been in the audience.The noise,the energy,the lights and no terms of comparison make everything look perfectly fine.The audience can be fooled easily." |
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Post by andy on Jun 6, 2006 3:11:25 GMT -5
Arden thanks i had not seen that.Well i guess it has gotten so good that we can't tell at times.SA is good and seens like a nice person with a family to take care of.A nd i am not blameing him he is not Mr P nor wil he ever be.No one can fill his shoes no matter how hard they try.
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Post by sexxymofo on Jun 6, 2006 7:09:25 GMT -5
I must say there is some hard evidence there! I think that Dean should persue this matter all the way I mean if he has gone this far why stop now? I hope he has the funds to do so because this can cost him tons of $$ and not to mention his life as I've read they have threatened him with death. I find it intresting that MANY other regular posters on that MR board agreed with him through private messaging but wont do so publicly . And now he has been banned from MR boards for speaking the truth I mean what is this world coming to? It's not like he was lipping it!  I don't know about you all but I believe him not because "he said so" but because I have ears and I can make up my own da*n mind! I don't know if you all reacall but Dean and I did not get along on that MR board so it's not like I am his blind follower and he my cult leader I guess to some ignorance is a bliss |
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Post by andy on Jun 6, 2006 7:40:47 GMT -5
Well i was not a fan of his either.I just bet that sock boy wanted him gone from there.The place is open once again.I can't believe i am saying this but will miss his point of view.And i do remember all to well in the way he responted back to you. IF this is ture i hope he dose something about it that is if he can.I don't feel he should have been banned for feeling that way & saying so.JMO!
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Post by properry on Jun 6, 2006 9:32:55 GMT -5
Well I'm not a expert on the tapes, but I lean heavily towards believing Deano, more than I do the band at this point. Deano "showed proof", while the band has NOT shown ANY evidence that it "isn't true", other than just sending that photographer guy to the other board to argue, and make threats, & insults on the board at those who did "not automatically" just believe it wasn't true.
Furthermore, IF I understood Deano right, I don't DON'T believe his intentions were to "hurt the band" by bringing this out in the open, HE has always expressed & been a great supporter of the 'current line up', & I THINK he was trying to get them to stop the lip synching. (That is just my opinion)
I think since there is "a question" that this is happening, & until the band DISPROVES it with "actual proof", Deano should have not been banned from the other board, that is wrong.
And incidently having Joe Elliot speak up for Journey is not really proof either, after all, he has a vested interest in Journey because THEY are touring together, he wants to make sure fans "keep coming" to the concerts, so him saying it is genuine, blah, blah, blah doesn't really mean anything to me.
Oh well, I'm very, very happy that I still have my wonderful concert memories, all fantastic music (Cd's, & DVD's) of the Perry/Journey years that I love so very much & highly respect as a GREAT , GREAT BAND!!!
I'm greatly looking forward to supporting whatever Steve Perry has to offer the fans!!!
Lori
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Post by sparkle2 on Jun 6, 2006 9:53:57 GMT -5
Wouldn't fans notice if he was lipping? Maybe not, remember Milli Vanilli? They got a Grammy for doing it! There are probably all kinds of technical tricks they can do now. I mean, people kind of expect it sometimes on tv or maybe even once in a while in concert if there is a problem, but the way concert tickets are priced now, to constantly do it live is just wrong. IMHO, just another example of Journey's total lack of respect for fans. Yeah, do whatever it takes to keep the money coming in... ::)sparkle |
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Post by andy on Jun 6, 2006 10:05:55 GMT -5
JMO! Here once again they don't give a fig about the fans any more.It's all about the money now they have bills to pay.Well then give a show without the lip synching if that is the case.I will never see journey again because there is now SP there.And he knows all to well the ship is sinking big time.
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Post by properry on Jun 6, 2006 10:15:53 GMT -5
I think it is very dificult at concerts for fans to be able to tell if a singer is lip synching the songs because usually your not up close to the stage, & the singer is contantly moving around the stage. Plus lot's of other distractions , the lighting, the noise level, etc. would make it real difficult for fans to pick up on whether a singer is lip synching or not.
Lori
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Post by lecalla on Jun 6, 2006 11:30:26 GMT -5
Lori, I agree with that...it would be extremely difficult for the audience to tell, esp. since most of the audience is well away from the stage.
I had the opportunity to see Journey in concert, '98 Ky State Fair. Even though Augeri was singing (or attempting to sing) those famous Journey tunes, there was something else I kept hearing...a little snatch of something, every time the man had to hit the high notes. Steve Perry's voice. At first I thought it was just wishful thinking on my part, but when my sister, who was all of 13 years old at the time, turned to me during "Don't Stop Believing" and said "Did you hear that? That was Steve's voice!" Well, let me tell you that I began to listen a bit harder and watch Jon a bit closer. We had a real good vantage point on Jon. Every single time Augeri had to go high, Jon reached over to a smallish black keyboard and quickly tapped some keys...kept his hand there until the high notes were over, then went back to the main keyboard and piano that he always plays. Just a bit too unusual for me. Also a bit suspicious. Also the guy didn't know when to stop singing the "Na-nas" at the end of LTS...again, he only sang the lower-range part of that.
Then came the accusations that Journey was using Steve Perry's voice in click-track. I believe that they did, indeed, use Mr. Perry's voice. I heard it, first hand.
After listening to what Deano has up in his blog, I have to say that these songs sound the same to me. I have no expertise in this area...but I do have ears. In the headphones, I can tell no distinctions. No matter who you are, you just don't sing exactly the same, on every stage, all the time...it just doesn't happen.
I think Deano has a legitimate claim, and if this turns out to be true then the Journey of today should have to give an explanation to the fans out there who paid their hard-earned money to see them perform live. They didn't give their hard-earned money up to hear "Memorex."
Augeri, imho, wasn't the best man to put in the lead singer seat for Journey. He's never had a "power-house," high tenor like Steve P. had back in the day. He's been pushing his voice to sound like Steve P., I agree...and if you're straining your voice to reach beyond its limits, one just doesn't bounce back from that. I know, because my Mother was an operatically trained high soprano. She sang professionally and in church for years. During a bout with pneumonia when I was around 18, my mother lost a considerable amount of range and has never recovered it. Totally sad, because her voice was absolutely beautiful. SA could not have "bounced back" from pneumonia or bronchitis (whichever one he was supposed to have had) so quickly, nor could he just "bounce back" from a blown vocal chord. It doesn't happen that fast, if ever at all.
If I hadn't heard what I know I heard in '98, and if Deano wasn't who he is---and that's someone who has been an advocate of the now line-up of Journey, a cheerleader of sorts for them---I don't know if I'd believe it. Taking everything into consideration, I happen to lean toward Deano's explanation and evidence. Maybe if the actual Journey camp comes out and addresses this issue and gives some proof to contradict...I'll change my mind.
This whole thing is very, very sad. Sadder still to think that people are saying "It's all Steve Perry's fault." May I ask exactly how??
Neal & Co. must pay the bills. So it goes---on and on and on and on.
Jmho, folks.
Hugs!! Love!!
Lee
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Post by Bill on Jun 6, 2006 11:34:22 GMT -5
For sake of fun i matched up both tracks of place in your heart (generations and one from the greek), I offset the tracks by 1/30th of a second so there is a mini super ever so slight offset (makes it easier to hear any differences actually) and with headphones on its sorta scary... about 85% of it matches up solid then after the last outro solo on guitar the vocals ARE different.
It could be they chopped it and at the last outro turned the mic on so he could finish out the song and talk to audience before next song (i guess its possible) or it could be they are that tight For sake of fun i matched up both tracks of place in your heart (generations and one from the greek), I offset the tracks by 1/30th of a second so there is a mini super ever so slight offset (makes it easier to hear any differences actually) and with headphones on its sorta scary... about 85% of it matches up solid perfect but after the last outro solo on guitar the vocals ARE different, could it be they chopped it and at the last outro turned the mic on so he could finish out the song and talk to audience before next song (i guess its possible) Im not saying this is proof of anything, i just took the track and matched them up from the two shows since in the blog it has not been done with this song (yet) so I figured I would do it to see what if anything I could hear.
Don't shoot the messenger here, all i did was take two tracks and merge them, they do match to a point then they dont match at about 80% in - so im curious what others think about it.
Bill
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Post by properry on Jun 6, 2006 11:48:16 GMT -5
For sake of fun i matched up both tracks of place in your heart (generations and one from the greek), I offset the tracks by 1/30th of a second so there is a mini super ever so slight offset (makes it easier to hear any differences actually) and with headphones on its sorta scary... about 85% of it matches up solid perfect but after the last outro solo on guitar the vocals ARE different, could it be they chopped it and at the last outro turned the mic on so he could finish out the song and talk to audience before next song (i guess its possible) Im not saying this is proof of anything, i just took the track and matched them up from the two shows since in the blog it has not been done with this song (yet) so I figured I would do it to see what if anything I could hear. Don't shoot the messenger here, all i did was take two tracks and merge them, they do match to a point then they dont match at about 80% in - so im curious what others think about it. Bill Oh Bill, we would never do that to you( shoot the messenger), you just gave your honest opinion of what you thought, no harm in that at all.  Lori |
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Post by Bill on Jun 6, 2006 11:55:37 GMT -5
And I dunno im still not sure of anything really, could be they are that tight when performing together I dunno, I think ill take a few older Perry shows from Escape era and try the same thing for fun, or a few FTLOSM shows and just see how MUCH different it is between the two versions..
I also have like 5 live neil diamond shows of my moms i can mess with so its not a Perry vs Augeri type thing (more just to see what happens when you take two live tracks of other bands and try this).
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Post by Bill on Jun 6, 2006 12:05:59 GMT -5
I just merged two tracks of steve perry singing on the FTLOSM tour side by side left and rights matched in synch, it took a total of about 12 seconds for things to fall totally out of synch and phrasing is TOTALLY off and different line by line, about 45 seconds into the song its so off i had to stop listening even.... Hey does that mean Moyes doesn't keep a steady beat? LOL he would get a kick outta that one...
I also took two neil diamond songs and merged them here left and right channels, they too are REALLY off after about 45-50 seconds and the phrasing vocally line by line is VERY different.
I am gonna dig around thru some old live shows of other bands I have here and see what if anything i can find for fun...
I need to go start a load of laundry tho before i do anything else hehe
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Post by arden on Jun 6, 2006 12:41:24 GMT -5
Bill, it's very interesting to see other performers and other concerts added to the mix!! The allegation is that they are using the 2001 DVD which is recorded live. There is no way that a live performance could be identical every time unless "enhancements" are being used. There are too many variables. In the explanation above it tells how the whole thing is loaded into the keyboard and controlled by the Keyboard player. That would explain reports of Jon looking so "bored" or "distracted". If he is having to run the playback as well, it would considerably interfere with his own performance. I just merged two tracks of steve perry singing on the FTLOSM tour side by side left and rights matched in synch, it took a total of about 12 seconds for things to fall totally out of synch and phrasing is TOTALLY off and different line by line, about 45 seconds into the song its so off i had to stop listening even.... Hey does that mean Moyes doesn't keep a steady beat? LOL he would get a kick outta that one... I also took two neil diamond songs and merged them here left and right channels, they too are REALLY off after about 45-50 seconds and the phrasing vocally line by line is VERY different. I am gonna dig around thru some old live shows of other bands I have here and see what if anything i can find for fun... I need to go start a load of laundry tho before i do anything else hehe |
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Post by leducred98 on Jun 6, 2006 12:59:11 GMT -5
they have bills to pay and child support checks to write and exwives to support(mainly NEAL!)
s
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Post by Bill on Jun 6, 2006 13:16:10 GMT -5
Man that blog site is getting hammered with visitors, its runnin SO slow at the moment i cant even get in with broadband without it timing out...
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Post by Bill on Jun 6, 2006 13:24:33 GMT -5
BTW I just matched up (same song same artist different live shows) two tracks from two live shows I have here from Metallica and they seem to merge much better (tighter in terms of staying in synch musically, drums dead on even) but still in this example - vocally you can tell difference after a few lines of listening, certain words said different or notes held a bit longer vs opposite sides cut off words... Still doesn't prove much of anything I realize Journey has toured for years on end, it could be they are that tight and he has those tracks down that solid but im waiting to hear more... Also for sake of discussion, what about songs that arent done on that dvd in question, or say in general sound checks etc, if his voice was going out on him wouldn't those sound "different" in a bootleg, in terms of him not hitting the higher notes or sounding raspy or whatever? Not being in a band not knowing really how it all works behind the scenes at this point I guess I have to say its just interesting to hear the ideas expressed and talked about... without all the trash talkin. Do you think back in the 80's there was ever a night they had to run a vocal track behind the old Journey setups? I know they toured super hard, if he was sick one night do you even think they COULD (not would) but could have technically even attempted it? Just curious, not saying Perry has ever lipped (besides music videos)... Heck i am open to discussion of any other artists too, are there any big live acts like this (besides ashley simpson or milli vanilli who to me are not big live established acts) where something went wrong and it was discovered the singer was lipping or something? Bill |
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Post by arden on Jun 6, 2006 14:49:53 GMT -5
Bill, I think the point was being made that Augeri does sound different on songs that are not on the DVD. His voice being decidely poorer. I don't believe that they had the technology to pull something like this off in the 80's. Perry is reputed to be such a perfectionist that I don't believe he would alllow it. He even sang over the playback during music videos. I believe Sparkle mentioned an interview where he was asked about doing the SSB. He was afraid of messing it up and refused when they offered to let him prerecord it. I think if Perry were going to use any help, it would have been when he was sick during FLOSM, however, he cancelled the shows rather than lip synch them. As disappointed as the fans who missed him were, I believe they would have been much more disappointed to discover that he had cheated them. If any lipping is done to any extent by other artists, it would probably the the performace/dance oriented artists such as Madonna or Britney Spears. Journey is simply not in that category. They are a band not dancers. For them to stoop to lip synching is just unacceptable. BTW I just matched up (same song same artist different live shows) two tracks from two live shows I have here from Metallica and they seem to merge much better (tighter in terms of staying in synch musically, drums dead on even) but still in this example - vocally you can tell difference after a few lines of listening, certain words said different or notes held a bit longer vs opposite sides cut off words... Still doesn't prove much of anything I realize Journey has toured for years on end, it could be they are that tight and he has those tracks down that solid but im waiting to hear more... Also for sake of discussion, what about songs that arent done on that dvd in question, or say in general sound checks etc, if his voice was going out on him wouldn't those sound "different" in a bootleg, in terms of him not hitting the higher notes or sounding raspy or whatever? Not being in a band not knowing really how it all works behind the scenes at this point I guess I have to say its just interesting to hear the ideas expressed and talked about... without all the trash talkin. Do you think back in the 80's there was ever a night they had to run a vocal track behind the old Journey setups? I know they toured super hard, if he was sick one night do you even think they COULD (not would) but could have technically even attempted it? Just curious, not saying Perry has ever lipped (besides music videos)... Heck i am open to discussion of any other artists too, are there any big live acts like this (besides ashley simpson or milli vanilli who to me are not big live established acts) where something went wrong and it was discovered the singer was lipping or something? Bill |
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Post by Bill on Jun 6, 2006 16:22:42 GMT -5
just matched up greek escape to tornoto escape, then matched that track to the vegas track, really weird note for note vocally its matchin up... even when i match up the SPLIT show to the vegas show (totally weird)...
Anyone with audio software can do this at home btw, just create a new sound file, take channel LEFT of one show same song, channel RIGHT of other song, CHOP/edit both so the lead ins and such are equal (so the words line up at first part sung etc) then let it roll and listen, side by side so far, escape, separate ways, and place in your heart have all synched up vocally...to be fair except that last 15% or so of place in your heart which IS different...
I am not gonna do any more matching up songs , I know too many people from BOTH Augeri Fans and Perry Fans who will no doubt start big fights with each other and I don't want to be part of all that.
I just don't want the hotel (altho its not my hotel i still visit daily) to become a trashing ground, but go out get a free trial of some audio software, go to the blog download 2,3 versions of the songs in question, take a min to splice them together side by side, put on headphones and what you will hear will be your own answer.
I think at this time I am done with this whole thing tho cuz either way its something I don't want to see taking over the hotel forum and becoming crazy city central like some other threads and boards have become from this same subject.
Just go do it for yourself, listen and judge on your own i guess is what im sayin...
I am sure the blog site will have more matched up versions to compare too, I think unless someone steps up and says yes I did do this or there is a mistake in a live setting it will be almost impossible to PROVE really its all speculation and opinion but each persons impression is their own and I respect their opinion here either way.
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Post by arden on Jun 6, 2006 16:45:47 GMT -5
I hope you don't feel pressured into any decisions that you make, Bill. I know that there are some people who will try to put pressure on you to make the discussions go away. I think the fact that Journey has not addressed the issue speaks volumes. We have one thread on this subject, and that is all we need. If any trashing starts, that will be deleted...not the thread. The Hotel, in addition to being very Pro Perry has not, and I hope will not, shy away from any discussions simply because they are unpopular with the current lineup fans. just matched up greek escape to tornoto escape, then matched that track to the vegas track, really weird note for note vocally its matchin up... even when i match up the SPLIT show to the vegas show (totally weird)... Anyone with audio software can do this at home btw, just create a new sound file, take channel LEFT of one show same song, channel RIGHT of other song, CHOP/edit both so the lead ins and such are equal (so the words line up at first part sung etc) then let it roll and listen, side by side so far, escape, separate ways, and place in your heart have all synched up vocally...to be fair except that last 15% or so of place in your heart which IS different... I am not gonna do any more matching up or replies on this, I know too many people from BOTH Augeri Fans and Perry Fans who will no doubt start big fights with each other and I don't want to be part of all that. I just don't want the hotel (altho its not my hotel i still visit daily) to become a trashing ground, but go out get a free trial of some audio software, go to the blog download 2,3 versions of the songs in question, take a min to splice them together side by side, put on headphones and what you will hear will be your own answer. I think at this time I am done with this whole thing tho cuz either way its something I don't want to see taking over the hotel forum and becoming crazy city central like some other threads and boards have become from this same subject. Just go do it for yourself, listen and judge on your own i guess is what im sayin... I am sure the blog site will have more matched up versions to compare too, I think unless someone steps up and says yes I did do this or there is a mistake in a live setting it will be almost impossible to PROVE really its all speculation and opinion but each persons impression is their own and I respect their opinion here either way. |
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Post by Bill on Jun 6, 2006 17:40:11 GMT -5
All I do gotta say is it is weird, very weird 3 different shows (escape song) all mirror image vocally, especially when i couldn't get metallica, neil diamond, steve perry journey era, steve perry ftlosm era, none of those that i tried to match up did match vocally and after a good 30-50 seconds the songs aren't even in synch anymore ....
To see this repeating itself with other songs too (all matching up vocally) sure does raise an eyebrow, yet there are plenty who are regular concert goers, behind stage fans etc that have seen 10+ shows that say no way, I guess I have been on the net for a good 10 years and seen every decent message board ever put on the net fall to pieces once people start bickering one side or another, and to me the hotel is just fun to get away and gab a bit, heck most of my posts arent even in the perry section they are just garble about other subjects hehe...
I do gotta say tho its weird that they are matching up SO well, I don't know that I can say I agree with some of the posts and replies AROUND this subject and the back and forth division it creates but I for one am curious to see how it all pans out in the end...
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Post by perrynow on Jun 6, 2006 18:56:46 GMT -5
I've listenend and it is too odd that he could sound that bad and that normal in the same song. As bad as he sounded, how could he have sounded like that and then normal even during the same CONCERT, and why would the tracks match up so perfectly for the most part? IMO, Cain is a snake....I'd bet anything he has this covered on his end. I, too, am interested to see where this goes. Augeri has had alot of time for a rest before this tour and more vocal coaches and voice conditioning than you could imagine to try to get through this tour w/ Def Leppard. It looks to me like the other board that closed, where this has been discussed first, has taken a censorhip approach to this so as not to alienate the band, since that is the priority over there. Funny, it is the fans that post, not the band, but the fans are censored if they think they are on to something. From what I've read, RocknDeano supported them so strongly, even at the expense of anyone who'd come there and critique them. Now he's the outcast because he is shining some light on this as a major ticket buying fan. I hope the truth is told, whatever it is. Journey was legendary for their live shows and Augeri was never up to Perry's range or endurance level. Not his "fault" for not being Steve Perry, but they did want fans to believe he was Perry with a perm and that he was at that level. You have to know they have been at least enhancing things in a major way to stay on the road each year. Especially last year.
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